Ideas for an Online Magazine of Mormon Fantasy and Science Fiction
Forums:
Body:
The success of James and Nicole Goldberg's 2012 Everyday Mormon Writer Four Centuries of Mormon Stories Contest in producing high quality Mormon sci-fi has me thinking the time may be ripe for a magazine of Mormon science fiction (and fantasy, too). I'm in the process of working up an article about the five entries that qualify as sci-fi, but in the meantime, it would be nice to get a discussion going to see what notions folks have about such a thing and in what ways, beside submitting stories, they'd be willing to contribute.
LDS-SF/F Guidelines
The first question is the audience: is the project LDS-oriented for LDS readers, or is it trying to bring LDS speculative writers to light for all audiences?
Is it open to all submissions, or do you have to show your temple recommend at the door? Gentiles might be able to show members some truths from a different angle.
Is LDS-based content required, or merely an LDS brain?
I remember reading two "LDSF" collections decades ago, and was published in a Christian SF/Fantasy 'online zine some years ago. I'd love to see a sustainable publication with a firm LDS foundation.
Good questions
I'll be posting an article with more of my thinking in this regard sometime over the next few days. Basically, though, I'd like it to be just LDS. Not just LDS in origin, however, but also in content. Stories wouldn't have to be about Sunday School on Mars or anything quite so blatantly LDS (although they could be), but the editors and readers should immediately sense that a Mormon mind with Mormon concerns is at work in the narrative and its embellishments. That's my view, anyway. I'm curious what other folks think. Thanks for your questions and views.
As for audience: let the audience take care of itself. Obviously, we're concerned about an LDS audience, but a lot of other folks might dig it, too. My main concern is encouraging, developing and promoting LDS talent in this field of literature.
I'm in
Fantasy is where my heart is for writing. I am nit very experienced, but would love to participate, and I am already thinking of possible titles :) like band names, they are most fun.
Getting experience
I'm not sure what you mean by "not very experienced", but your participation is certainly welcome.
Definitely interested
I'm definitely interested in this idea. A lot has been written about how Mormon writers are drawn to sci fi and fantasy, and there are a lot of LDS writers in mainstream speculative fiction, but not much has been done with LDS focused content. The question is, will it be possible to have enough people regularly submitting LDS-focused speculative fiction to merit an entire online magazine? Perhaps there will be--as you said, 5 of the finalists would fall in that category (mine was "Waiting").
I have minimum time available to give out to things (I have 2 kids under the age of 2), but if this develops into something, I would be interested in helping, perhaps on the editorial side of things (i.e. reviewing submissions). Keep me updated. (I sent you a friend request on Facebook, by the way.)
Interest helps
And a mighty fine story it was, Kathy. You could well win the contest.
As for the question of volume, I think if we remember it's online and ruminate outside the proverbial cubic container, we can put together something that achieves a purpose. Right now I'm thinking combination e-zine, web portal, fanzine, forum and whatever else might fit.
Expect to have your friend request accepted.
You should go for it.
.
I'm not willing to take an active role, but I think you should go for it. Given my experience with M&M, I can guarantee work is out there, just looking for a place to put it.
Encouragement counts
Fair enough, Eric. But I hope you'll have a little content for us.
Oh! Me! Pick me!
I already have like five things that fall into this category that I could submit, were your dream to become a reality. If I had more experience in publishing, I would volunteer to take a more active role. As it is, I am just putting my toe into the waters of the writing world, so I'd probably just remain content with submitting my work until you ask me not to any more.
Enthusiasm is a plus
I like your attitude, Beth. I actually envision the project as partially mentoring and developing, so if you've got promise, good things should happen at some level. By the way, mentoring and developing are two things I look forward to getting myself.
Ammendments
If you're absolutely desperate for people, I will do it, even though I don't really know what I'm doing. I guess you'd have to be pretty desperate.
A place for everybody and everybody in their place
I don't think any bonafide professionals will be in the starting lineup, so don't fret too much about "qualifications". I envision it as a cooperative, collaborative, communal sort of thing, so I doubt anybody'll end up having to handle a tough job all alone.It'll be learn and grow and stub your toes for a while, I imagine.
Magazine, or e-Collective?
Back in about 2006, I was webcrazy. I rented space on a Siteground server and built a dozen or more different sites for different purposes. Among them was one I called O-WIRe, the Online Writers', Illustrators' and Readers' e-Collective. Like I say, I was webcrazy and I wanted to make a place where people who write and draw could get together with people who read and admire. It seemed like a good idea at the time and it seems like one now. What the world of Mormon fantasy and sci-fi needs is not a magazine, but an e-collective which does way more than a magazine can to bring the makers and the takers together and let them affect each other.
One problem with conventional magazines is the gatekeeping. A handful (if that many) of human individuals with their own agendas and tastes get to be big men in little worlds and say no to most of what crosses their desks, either because it's no good in their eyes or because there's no more room at the inn. What if you could publish in a magazine without an editor's permission and let the readers decide whether your work deserved attention? Like most things in life, it can't quite be as simple as that, but consider this...
One big complaint in the academic world is the bottlenecking of potentially excellent work by the paucity of outlets and the slow pace of peer review. Peer review is fine as a stamp of approval that shortens the reading list, but as we've seen in the areas of cold fusion and cloning, it doesn't guarantee quality, and the need for it puts sand in the bearings. What if folks could post their work on a website and other folks could judge it for themselves without editors and reviewers coming in between to gum things up? What if the community reviewed? This was the idea behind the SPAJ concept, which I came up with in 2005 while pursuing an online Master of Distance Education degree through Athabasca University. Student, Professional and Academic Journals would be websites on which students, professionals and academics would post and assess their thinking, experience and research. Rather than letting a few supposed paragons in private chambers decide what should be consumed, the community would make its own way through the mass of of work on offer. Of course it could get a bit unwieldy, but with time, I think, standards and networks would weed out the crackpots and rank amateurs and good work itself would get noticed and recognized.
That was the theory behind The Student, Professional and Academic Journals of Distance Education and Applied Linguistics, the two combination weblogs and journals I built in my lonely corner of cyberspace. And that is the theory I'd like to apply to the problem of cultivating and disseminating good Mormon fantasy and science fiction. Why burden a handful of shortsighted mortals who would rather be writing their own stories anyway with the Herculean task of sorting through file on file of potentially good, possibly bad fiction when the community could do it faster and more accurately? It's a website, so there's no appreciable limit on space. Groups and networks would form to judge and promote the offerings. Work with high levels of approval could be displayed on an appropriately labeled page. In short, the community of people producing and consuming the work could work together to identify and proclaim the stories and authors it finds worthy of attention.
In with all the reading and weeding, the community could participate directly in the development of both the work and the talent behind it. Stories could be discussed and suggestions for improvement made. More experienced and adept authors could guide the less experienced and less adept. Authors could get feedback from a community that knows and loves the kind of work trying to be produced.
Perhaps most excitingly, being online, the site could connect devotees and wanderers with the webpositions of its participants. An author working on a piece for general consumption could invite those interested to visit his or her personal site and take a hand in critiquing and toning the piece. What reader wouldn't want to be able to say, "I helped make that story great"?
In short, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls, mesdames et messieurs, it's all about readers and writers coming together like never before to just plain sit around the fire and folk out a legacy of narrative art.
What say you?
I've owned LDSSF.com for
I've owned LDSSF.com for years, just in case I ever got around to starting an LDS speculative fiction magazine.
That Domain Name, Which Thou Hast Owned
Is that an offer to donate? Or are you just saying?
For anyone reading this comment who doesn't know yet, Eric James Stone is the LDS author of the Nebula Award winning (and Hugo nominated) "That Leviathan, Whom Thou Hast Made", which definitely qualifies as Mormon science fiction, even though it was published in a Gentile magazine.
Maybe Hugo and Nebula nominated Nancy Fulda ("Movement") will drop by some time, too.
Announcing at AML blog, elsewhere
If/when you reach the point of launching this, I'd welcome a guest post at the AML blog describing your project and inviting people to participate. One of my goals for the AML blog has been to make it the kind of place where people could hear about projects like this.
Speaking of which: If you haven't already done so, you might want to get in touch with The Leading Edge, the student sf&f magazine published at BYU (or possibly formerly published at BYU; I don't know their current status). Their focus is mainstream sf&f, not Mormon-oriented, but they're working in many of the same pools and with many of the same issues you're likely to encounter. I believe they recently transferred to an electronic presence.
You also might want to consider seeing if you can get some kind of presence at Life, the Universe and Everything to help launch things. It's certainly the place you're likely to get the largest density of Mormon sf&f writers as well as readers.
Thanks and an Update
Fantastic, Jonathan! And thanks for the leads.
My current thinking is along the lines of what you might call a tiered and clouded community. Writers and readers can sign up and develop their own presences on the site. The site is divided into sections, including, say, stories chosen by a panel, stories ranked by popularity and/or views, et cetera, et cetera. The idea is to have a place where people can share and find. There will be a magazine-like aspect, but it will not be limited to the size or prejudices of a magazine. My main concern, as I've said before, is to encourage and nurture Mormon speculative fiction and to give the slumbering giants some room to wake up in.
Love the Idea
I'd be really excited to see such an outlet. I think it would be a lot of fun. Count me in as a supporter.
Glad to have you
Jonathan Langford and I are moving toward some posts on Dawning of a Brighter Day to drum up some pre-launch discussion so the final design can reflect the communities needs. I envision something much more social than a mere e-zine.
YES! Because even when I'm not writing LDSpec fiction, I am
I like the sound of things and will do what I can to contribute and support the venture.
Rockin'
What can I say more?
Count Me In, on Several Fronts!
[My wife, Sarah Dunster, suggested that I join this conversation.]
I like the direction this discussion has gone. What I see proposed is a community site for fostering LDS writers and promoting writing on LDS subject matter (two distinct purposes). LDSSF is one genre to support, and a great place to start! But expect the community to immediately overflow the boundaries of any one genre.
I like community theory. In my opinion, this project has great promise, best realized with a strong community model and distributed responsibilities.
As the community reaches critical mass, and collects work to showcase, one or more magazines (or other display formats) could federate with the community, whether community-controlled or not. The fact that a particular showcase is based on grassroots prestige, peer review, or editorial selection doesn't matter when you can have more than one showcase. Ideally, there would be many showcases with a collaborative relationship between them and their readers.
The risk of this federated approach is dilution of attention, or the fragmentation of loyalties and interests, until nothing thrives. Communities are like fires and need a balance of proximity (mutual heat) and freedom (air). This idea will start small, but will need a plan for expanding by division, as needed (as the air gets stiffling).
Communities must have clear leadership/cultivation by one or more "gardeners"; stewards and mentors with a clear responsibility to cultivate the best community possible. As the communities grow and divide, these leaders form a republic.
I'm in favor of this effort and I can lend a hand in several ways. I am a web development and communications consultant with a personal interest in writing and editing, community cultivation, publishing, and content curation. I'm a thoroughbred techie with a corresponding love of SciFi. But I also have a lot of other interests and abilities to contribute, as needed.
This idea is probably too premature to ask, but are you inclined to build on Drupal? That's my platform of choice. How do you like Drupal Gardens?
[I hope to return this evening and reply to specific comments.]
I love your wife, but she's all yours
Thanks to Sarah for passing on the bug I put in her ear.
I asked for you specifically, Jeff, because I knew you were a Drupal dude. Drupal is the platform I want to use, because it can do pretty much whatever you want except self-replicate and colonize the Moon. As for DrupalGardens: I was considering renting webspace and running a separate installation, but if DG (free or paid) can provide the space, bandwidth and modules we need, I'm hip with it.
Not long after proposing the fantasy/sci-fi site, I started thinking that at some level, somehow the concept should be all-inclusive, whether we expand to include other genres or join a "federation" as you call it. Using Views, expanding is no issue. Neither is offering a myriad ways to view content (e-zine, most frequently viewed, highest rated, separate genres, most popular authors, authors'/readers' blogs, authors'/readers' likes, whatever we think of).
Right now, I envision, for a particular genre or set of genres, a sort of summary/selected works space (the e-zine) which people who want some content but don't want to network could go to. This might develop into a paid subscription service, but will begin as just another View. Also for each genre or set of genres, I see various views, as suggested in the previous paragraphs. In short, the site will contain a great deal of local content submitted by contributors (who we'll probably vet in some fashion: we don't want a profaning free-for-all, but we do want a fairly democratic gathering space). Writers and readers can apply for accounts, through which they provide and respond to content. I would like to see webportals linking to group and individual venues such as association websites and personal blogs. I would like to see writers and users linking (webring) and importing (feeds?) offsite content.
Basically, although there would be a sort of magazine (or set of magazines) which would be selective in some fashion, we would go way beyond that model in offering a social space in which writers and readers would flourish as contributors, users and communities.
I'll take more time later to properly digest your remarks and respond more intelligibly. Thanks for coming onboard.
It's probably not necessary, but you almost sound like you're applying for a job, so I'd better clarify for you and anybody else who might be interested in helping that at this point, all pariticipation will have to be volunteer. There is no money anywhere for anybody. It's labour of love from top to bottom.
Sandbox
Once we've roughed out an architecture, we should build a little sandbox to play in. I'd rather there be a stable structure we add onto than a fluctuating core. I hate going back to a site and finding everything has been moved and reconnected.
.
.
I think all such lines are artificial and will wear away with time anyway. That said, it may be true that carefully defined boundaries will be useful in nurturing a nascent project.
Which lines?
You mean between magazine, fanzine, blog and all that?
Drupal, Drupal Gardens and the the Other Stuff You Mention
Drupal
I love Drupal. I intend to use Drupal. I used to build and run my own Drupal sites. I have an account on drupal.org. Does that answer that question?
Drupal Gardens
Drupal Gardens is pretty good. They seem to be expanding the options for free accounts: I recently discovered a handful of new models. It's a good place for a sandbox and a good place to get started. As there's no money coming in at this point, the less one has to spend, the better. However, if the site gets really busy or we need modules Drupal Gardens doesn't offer, we may have to move to paid hosting and run our own installation. I really hope I don't have to run an isntallation myself. I can do it, but it's time-consuming, what with all the security updates and block and module upgrades.
Genres
I've changed the range from fantasy and science fiction to speculative fiction. I'd like to include every type of fiction, but instinct tells me to start out with tempered ambition. I'm open to being convinced otherwise, though. Speculative fiction covers a lot of ground: sci-fi, fantasy, supernatural, horror, magic realism--anything involving plot devices that don't happen in real life.
Community Model
Yes. We need a modules. I'm thinking benevolent dictatorship with street-level full democracy. We establish codes of conduct and all that, but reserve the right to summarily expel anyone who's working against our purposes, whether the rules justify expulsion or not. I don't want to police everything, but if someone's poisoning the well, I want to be able to kick them out without a lot of fuss. This is the way most web communities operate. I'm open to all kinds of ideas, though. I want to build a place where people are happy and flourish.
Responsibilities
Like I say, I can build and maintain a Drupal site. I've done it before. However, I want to focus on writing. That's why I'm looking for help with the mechanics of the site. I'll also want help, as you say, with the different social areas of the site. Again, I'm open to suggestions.
Showcases
One big point of this project is to explore the possibilities. I see Wattpad is doing some of what I have in mind. But, yeah, the site will likely evolve as people find new needs and think of new designs. I want to make it as flexible as possible from the start and build in the ability to expand and reshape.
Reader-Writer Collaboration
Absolutely. As I mentioned in a previous comment, I once worked on developing an Online Writers', Illustrators' and Readers' e-Collective (OWIRe) with the aim of bringing all those folks together into communication and collaboration. In part, we're talking about electronic folk literature with feedback between creators and consumers.
Dilution, Fragmentation, Expansion and Division
Important concerns. I like the fire analogy. I imagine leaders will emerge and it will be more a matter of putting local executive power in the hands of people who share and can spread and enforce the vision (artistic and spiritual). Kind of like a stake dividing into wards.
Gardeners, Stewards and Mentors
All good words and good ideas. I want Lowly Seraphim (or whatever we end up calling it) to be a place where people meet, share their work, enjoy other people's work, help each other improve as writers and readers (and illustrators and viewers), and construct a strong, cohesive Mormon speculative fiction community with a definite, if fuzzy, identity and the power to support a few careers. Building the site with offsite inclusion in mind should allow for other sites to join the effort but retain their autonomy and idiosyncracy and for people to splinter off while retaining ties with us.
Sandbox Up, Not Running
I've set up a sandbox at http://lowlyseraphim.drupalgardens.com. Over the next few days I'll be fiddling with the architecture. DrupalGardens free doesn't appear to offer some of the modules I'd like, such as view counts, like buttons and scoring, so we'll probably have to export what we settle on and import to a paid site with the desired options.
I May Be Wrong about Some of That
They appear to have added features, including Statistics and Five Star. We may be more or less in business for the moment.
Beaten to it?
While listening to The Next Chapter, a CBC Radio literary program, I heard about Wattpad (Wikipedia), which, wouldn't you know it, is pretty close in concept and design to my idea for Lowly Seraphim.
Add new comment | Mars Denar
What's up, I read your blog on a regular basis. Your humoristic style is awesome, keep it up!
Post new comment